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Help for First Build

Sqawker

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Help for First Build
« on: November 12, 2010, 07:07:13 pm »
This will be my first build and I want to ‘go’ with components that are relatively proven  (if possible).  I am retired and would like a computer that I have learned enough to maintain and update.  My main use for this computer would be photoshop, video editing, flash , web, and database  development – as a hobby.

I have recently purchased a Phenom II X6 1090T and both 64bit and 32bit version(s) of Windows 7 Ultimate.  Intend to  run the 64bit  if possible,
I have purchased a used ThermalTake Armor case with fans included (no power supply).
I will buy the motherboard first:  next the RAM,  next the power supply,  next  the hard drive,  next the graphics card ( HD 5770 ),  somewhere in there the DVD/CD and FDD.

MOTHERBOARD
After reading Absic’s conversation with someone in your forum, I believe that I will go with the GA-890XA-UD3 because Absic had some experience with a similar board and  the XA-UD3 was very close to the GA-890gpa-U3HD that I had tentatively selected.

MEMORY
In terms of memory, I will run at 1333 Mhz – I have no intention to overclock or whatever.  I just want to build a computer that I can learn to maintain and update by myself.
 
Ultimately, I would like to install  4  sticks of 4GB each RAM. However I can only afford two sticks now (2X4GB) .
 
Q1.. So is it possible to have only 8Gb in two sticks – then add two more 4GB sticks later?

Q2. For my MoBo and CPU could you give me an exact  memory stick that would work in my situation?

POWER SUPPLY
Q3.. I understand that one could use as much power as one can get.  I understand 700+ watts is good.  How do you know what is a good quality pwr supply? Could you recommend a power supply that is reasonably good quality and over 700 Watts?

SOFTWARE
Q4.. If I run Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit can I typically run 32bit software on a 64bit operating system (assuming that the software in question  would normally run under Windows 7 32bit)?

DVD
Q5.. What would you recommend as a DVD/CD reader/writer (I have been writing –R  format on DVD and CD in the past)?
 
I understand that advice you give me is not guaranteed to work.  But since I know little or nothing about the nuances of hardware (particularly memory specification babble), your advice puts me miles ahead.
Thanks in advance for any help,  Sqawker.

Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2010, 12:57:25 am »
Q1.. So is it possible to have only 8Gb in two sticks – then add two more 4GB sticks later?

Yes you can run only two sticks and later add 2 more sticks. It would be best to end up with all four sticks being the same brand and part number. Doing so is hit or miss because you may or may not be able to find the exact same memory later when you decide to add eight more gigs. You may need to drop the speed from 1333 to 1066 or loosen timings etc. to get 4 modules stable.  

Q2. For my MoBo and CPU could you give me an exact  memory stick that would work in my situation?

Gigabyte tests very few memory brands and types so their QVL list for ram is not very useful. I normally use Corsair or Crucial memory in all my builds. Both have a memory configurator on their site. Corsair here http://www.corsair.com/configurator/product_results.aspx?id=1536858#other_modules
Crucial here http://www.crucial.com/store/listparts.aspx?model=GA-890XA-UD3
Since you are not going to over clock normal 1333 memory should be fine. Write down the part numbers for all the 1333 8 gig kits from both manufactures and then see which ones you can find for purchase from the supplier you want to use.

Q3.. I understand that one could use as much power as one can get.  I understand 700+ watts is good.  How do you know what is a good quality pwr supply? Could you recommend a power supply that is reasonably good quality and over 700 Watts?

Power supplies are the most important part of a PC build. I use Corsair or Seasonic supplies when possible. Most Corsair supplies are made by Seasonic. Looking at your build I would think a quality 550 watt supply would be all you would need. To be sure enter in all your hardware here and see what you need for sure. http://www.extreme.outervision.com/psucalculator.jsp

Q4.. If I run Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit can I typically run 32bit software on a 64bit operating system (assuming that the software in question  would normally run under Windows 7 32bit)?
 
32 bit OS's only supports 4 gigs of ram so you will need to install 64 bit windows 7. Most if not all 32 bit programs work fine in Windows 7 64 bit. Note any 32 bit programs used will not be able to use more than 2 gigs of memory. This is not a limitation of Windows 7 is a limitation caused by 32 bit programs. To use the full potential or your new PC you may need newer versions of the software you use.  AKA photoshop, video editing  software etc. Do some research on the versions of the programs you are going to use. Do they support Windows 7? 64 bit etc.

Q5.. What would you recommend as a DVD/CD reader/writer (I have been writing –R  format on DVD and CD in the past)?

If you burn lots of dual layer DVD's a Sony Optiarc drive that uses a NEC chipset would be a good choice or any drive that uses a NEC chipset. If you do not burn many dual layer DVD's Lite-On drives that use the Mediatek chipset are a good choice. You may want to get two drives, one using the NEC chipset and one using the Mediatek chipset and have the best of both worlds. Asus makes a Lite-On clone that uses the Mediatek chipset and they are very reasonably priced. I just love all 5 of mine. New egg has them in stock. http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007589+50001315&QksAutoSuggestion=&ShowDeactivatedMark=False&Configurator=&IsNodeId=1&Subcategory=5&description=&Ntk=&CFG=&SpeTabStoreType=&srchInDesc=
I have DRW-24B3LT's and DRW-24B1ST's. Keep in mind not all Sony Optiarc drives use the NEC chipset and not all Lite-On drives use the Mediatek chipset. Most Sony Optiarc drives are actually made by Lite-On and may or may not use the NEC chipset.

edit, updated burner info

Bill

« Last Edit: November 13, 2010, 02:46:52 am by Wonderwrench »
Main Box*i7 930@3.5 Ghz*CM V6 GT*GA X58A-UD3R v2 FB bios*3x4 gig Patriot DDR3 1600 EL*EVGA GTX 460 1 gig*OCZ Vertex 3 MI 120 gig*WD  Blue 500 gig*ASUS DRW-24B3LT*Samsung SH-S223L*Teac Floppy*Corsair AX750*Rosewill R6AR6-BK case*Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit SP1

bytheway_r

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Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2010, 02:04:10 am »
Q1 - I'm not saying you can't go for 4GB sticks but with how fast computers change there's no point, really. Unless you have a lot of spare money and want top of the top performance... for about a year. Being you I'd go for 4x2GB as that's really the most reasonable value ( 8GB ).

Q3 - I'm just guessing but I have the feeling that you'd like to use this PC for a few years? If yes, then it'd be prudent to have a little more power than is needed as the PSU will degrade over time. Still, like Wonderwrench said, 700W+ isn't really necessary in your case. To really be on the safe side I'd go with a 600W quality PSU ( assuming you'll keep it for at least 2-3 years ).

Q4 - if the software would run without problems on Windows 7 32bit then it should be perfectly fine with the 64bit version, too. Generally, Windows 7 should work with all software that was made for Windows XP or Vista. Not sure about stuff meant for even older systems.

What else to add. I'd buy 2 hard drives, maybe one external, to have one as back-up. Nothing hurts as much as loss of important data. I'd look for something reasonably fast, too ( considering that your PC will be quite a beast ).

Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2010, 02:22:08 am »
Q1 - I'm not saying you can't go for 4GB sticks but with how fast computers change there's no point, really. Unless you have a lot of spare money and want top of the top performance... for about a year. Being you I'd go for 4x2GB as that's really the most reasonable value ( 8GB ).

Q3 - I'm just guessing but I have the feeling that you'd like to use this PC for a few years? If yes, then it'd be prudent to have a little more power than is needed as the PSU will degrade over time. Still, like Wonderwrench said, 700W+ isn't really necessary in your case. To really be on the safe side I'd go with a 600W quality PSU ( assuming you'll keep it for at least 2-3 years ).

Q4 - if the software would run without problems on Windows 7 32bit then it should be perfectly fine with the 64bit version, too. Generally, Windows 7 should work with all software that was made for Windows XP or Vista. Not sure about stuff meant for even older systems.

What else to add. I'd buy 2 hard drives, maybe one external, to have one as back-up. Nothing hurts as much as loss of important data. I'd look for something reasonably fast, too ( considering that your PC will be quite a beast ).

The price on 4 gig modules has come way down. Many kits with 2x4 gig modules can be had for under $150.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007611%20600006050%20600006069&IsNodeId=1&bop=And&ShowDeactivatedMark=False&Order=PRICE&PageSize=20
Main Box*i7 930@3.5 Ghz*CM V6 GT*GA X58A-UD3R v2 FB bios*3x4 gig Patriot DDR3 1600 EL*EVGA GTX 460 1 gig*OCZ Vertex 3 MI 120 gig*WD  Blue 500 gig*ASUS DRW-24B3LT*Samsung SH-S223L*Teac Floppy*Corsair AX750*Rosewill R6AR6-BK case*Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit SP1

Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2010, 02:43:51 am »
Non modular supplies

Corsair 650 watt PSU for $70 after rebate with free shipping. It does not have modular cabling though.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139005

Seasonic 620 watt for under $85 shipped
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151096

Modular supplies

Corsair 650 watt for $116 shipped after rebate.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139012

Seasonic 620 watt for $106 shipped.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151095

Bill
Main Box*i7 930@3.5 Ghz*CM V6 GT*GA X58A-UD3R v2 FB bios*3x4 gig Patriot DDR3 1600 EL*EVGA GTX 460 1 gig*OCZ Vertex 3 MI 120 gig*WD  Blue 500 gig*ASUS DRW-24B3LT*Samsung SH-S223L*Teac Floppy*Corsair AX750*Rosewill R6AR6-BK case*Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit SP1

Sqawker

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Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2010, 10:01:55 pm »
WOW!! Thanks for the help.  It was encyclopedic. Wonderwrench, you are fantastic.  You nailed the RAM for me and the PSU.  I now can specificly list the parts that I need along with their price.  Somewhere I read that Newegg was very good with keeping customers happy so I will probably go with them rather than just going with the lowest price (as long as the difference is not much).

Looks like thw ASUS DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS Black SATA 24x DVD Burner is a winner and a great price.  Thanks for info. You have 5 of these, you need to have stock in their company!

Bytheway_r, you had some good info.  Yes, I would like to keep it for years to come, upgrading it as it becomes necessary. Are you saying  ("...I'm not saying you can't go for 4GB sticks but with how fast computers change there's no point, really.") that if,for example, I see that If I change the MoBo then I probably would have to change the RAM.  Is it also likely that if I only change the CPU, I might have to change the RAM?

This is a good point and I need to think about it for awhile.  However, why would buying 4 X 2GB sticks be preferable to buying 2 x 4GB sticks?  If I buy 4 x 2GB sticks and decide to go to 16GB then I waste the 4 x 2GB sticks.  Is there a reason to use 4 x 2GB over 2 x 4GB?  Is it a value thing - that you mention?

In sum...............
I will go with the "CORSAIR HX Series CMPSU-650HX 650W ATX12V v2.2 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI Ready 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply".  With a name that long, you can't miss somthing . (LOL)   This seems like a quality component.

Will be thinking about 8GB vrs future 16GB but thanks to both of youl I know whick sticks to buy.

Decided on the GA-890XA-UD3 MoBo ,  the HD 5770 graphics card and the ASUS DVD writer.

Much appreciation.  It will be a month or two before I get these items.  My wife is about to ask me for 'what I want for Christmas', then I will see what is left to fanagle (very important word for married man).  You see, my wife still works and I have been retired since 2003.

Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2010, 05:09:35 am »
As far as the ram goes if getting four 2 gig sticks does not save you much money over two 4 gig sticks get two 4 gig sticks. In the past two 4 gig sticks cost more than twice as much as four 2 gig sticks so it made more sense to save some money and hope you did not want to add more ram later.

I have always liked Lite-On CD/DVD burners (that use the Mediatek chipset)  because they can read disks other drives can't, damaged/scratched/poor quality etc. They also read faster than most and do not have riplock. Write quality has been good on every one I ever owned as long as you use quality media.  I also like the ability to do disk quality scanning using CD-DVD Speed or similar programs. See screen shot below. The only things Mediatek based drives do not excel at is burning dual layer DVD's and CDR's. They do a decent job but not as good as NEC chipset based drives. The reason I have so many Asus burners is is because finding out which drives use the Mediatek chipset is not an easy task. Asus DVD burners are clones of the last gen Lite-On drives and use the Mediatek chipset. I would guess sooner or later these drives will be gone so I would get one while their still available.

Bill
« Last Edit: November 14, 2010, 05:10:58 am by Wonderwrench »
Main Box*i7 930@3.5 Ghz*CM V6 GT*GA X58A-UD3R v2 FB bios*3x4 gig Patriot DDR3 1600 EL*EVGA GTX 460 1 gig*OCZ Vertex 3 MI 120 gig*WD  Blue 500 gig*ASUS DRW-24B3LT*Samsung SH-S223L*Teac Floppy*Corsair AX750*Rosewill R6AR6-BK case*Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit SP1

Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2010, 02:01:04 pm »
Newegg has the Sony Optiarc AD-7260S-0B drives on sale for $15.99 with free shipping. This drive uses the NEC chipset so it is a great dual layer DVD burner and CDR burner. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827118039

No sales on Mediatek based drives at this time as far as I can see. The Asus DRW-24B1ST and DRW-24B3LT drives are $19.99 plus $4.99 shipping.
Not a bad deal as they are great drives. Media scanning out of box, no rip lock, best readers bar none, great single layer DVD burning etc.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007589+50001315&QksAutoSuggestion=&ShowDeactivatedMark=False&Configurator=&IsNodeId=1&Subcategory=5&description=&Ntk=&CFG=&SpeTabStoreType=&srchInDesc=

Bill
Main Box*i7 930@3.5 Ghz*CM V6 GT*GA X58A-UD3R v2 FB bios*3x4 gig Patriot DDR3 1600 EL*EVGA GTX 460 1 gig*OCZ Vertex 3 MI 120 gig*WD  Blue 500 gig*ASUS DRW-24B3LT*Samsung SH-S223L*Teac Floppy*Corsair AX750*Rosewill R6AR6-BK case*Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit SP1

CanUK

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Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2010, 06:38:23 pm »
WOW!! Thanks for the help.  It was encyclopedic. Wonderwrench, you are fantastic.  You nailed the RAM for me and the PSU.  I now can specificly list the parts that I need along with their price.  Somewhere I read that Newegg was very good with keeping customers happy so I will probably go with them rather than just going with the lowest price (as long as the difference is not much).

Looks like thw ASUS DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS Black SATA 24x DVD Burner is a winner and a great price.  Thanks for info. You have 5 of these, you need to have stock in their company!

Bytheway_r, you had some good info.  Yes, I would like to keep it for years to come, upgrading it as it becomes necessary. Are you saying  ("...I'm not saying you can't go for 4GB sticks but with how fast computers change there's no point, really.") that if,for example, I see that If I change the MoBo then I probably would have to change the RAM.  Is it also likely that if I only change the CPU, I might have to change the RAM?

This is a good point and I need to think about it for awhile.  However, why would buying 4 X 2GB sticks be preferable to buying 2 x 4GB sticks?  If I buy 4 x 2GB sticks and decide to go to 16GB then I waste the 4 x 2GB sticks.  Is there a reason to use 4 x 2GB over 2 x 4GB?  Is it a value thing - that you mention?

In sum...............
I will go with the "CORSAIR HX Series CMPSU-650HX 650W ATX12V v2.2 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI Ready 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply".  With a name that long, you can't miss somthing . (LOL)   This seems like a quality component.

Will be thinking about 8GB vrs future 16GB but thanks to both of youl I know whick sticks to buy.

Decided on the GA-890XA-UD3 MoBo ,  the HD 5770 graphics card and the ASUS DVD writer.

Much appreciation.  It will be a month or two before I get these items.  My wife is about to ask me for 'what I want for Christmas', then I will see what is left to fanagle (very important word for married man).  You see, my wife still works and I have been retired since 2003.

I like your choice of PSU, it is modular and a decent rating.  Good mother board, almost bought one myself.

The only change I might make would be the graphics.  Is there a large price difference between the 5770 and 6870? If not then the 6870 would be a better choice.

Edit:  Should have put the 6850 instead, not 6870. 
« Last Edit: November 16, 2010, 06:41:42 pm by CanUK »
Mobo: Gigabyte GA-890FXA-UD5
CPU: Phenom II 965 BE - stock for now
HSF: NH-D14
RAM:8GB Gskill Ripjaws 1333 8-8-8-24 2T
GFX: Sapphire 6870
PSU: Corsair 850HX
Case: Antec 900

Dark Mantis

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    • Dark Mantis
Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2010, 08:28:21 pm »
Although I would agree with you about the graphics card and would go for the new 6850 don't forget that they have changed the numbering sequence on the new series and the 6850 equates to the 5830 in reality. The 6870 would be the natural progression of the 5850. As you say though for the small extra bit of hard earned I would definitely buy the 6850.
Gigabyte X58A-UD7
i7 920
Dominators 1600 x6 12GB
6970 2GB
HX850
256GB SSD, Sam 1TB, WDB320GB
Blu-Ray
HAF 932

Gigabyte Z68X-UD5-B3
i7 3770K
Vengeance 1600 16GB
6950 2GB
HCP1200W
Revo Drive x2, 1.5TB WDB RAID0
16x DLRW
StrikeX S7
Full water cooling
3 x 27" Iiy

jannie

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Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #10 on: November 16, 2010, 10:05:34 pm »
Hi Sqawker,,,Good choice of mobo. These guys here will help you through the build if your stuck. I have built two now with the help of ABSIC and DM.
best of luck
2x Cooler Master HAF X full tower
Gigabyte GA-890XA-UD3 AMD 790X AM3 Motherboard
AMD CPU Phenom II 1090Tx6
Corsair Memory XMS3 Classic 8GB DDR3 PC3-10666 (1333)
Corsair HX 850 W  (PSU)
Noctua NH-U12P-SE2 CPU Cooler
1GB Gigabyte NVIDIA GTX 460 OC Graphic

Sqawker

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Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2010, 04:37:32 pm »
CanUK, Mantis,

I looked at the HD 6850 (approx $260) and I would like to have it. Unfortunately I have to keep expenses down for the project and since I am not going to be gaming or anything unusual, the HD 5770 at $154 would fit my purpose very well.  Before I order, I will review and it will depend on which "ME" is at the keyboard - the impulsive me or the conservative me.

By the way, there are two HD 5770s both have same description except for one is "Express 2.0" and the other is "Express 2.1". My assumption is that I should get the 2.1 (I assume updated) version.  Is this a good assumption?

Thanks for the update.

Dark Mantis

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    • Dark Mantis
Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2010, 04:43:57 pm »
As I understand it the versions are compatible anyway so I always go for the most up to date.
I undersatnd what you are saying regarding the graphics cards and I'm sure that performace wise the 5770 would do you just fine then but do bear in mind that the newer 6850 is also cooler and quieter apparently.
Gigabyte X58A-UD7
i7 920
Dominators 1600 x6 12GB
6970 2GB
HX850
256GB SSD, Sam 1TB, WDB320GB
Blu-Ray
HAF 932

Gigabyte Z68X-UD5-B3
i7 3770K
Vengeance 1600 16GB
6950 2GB
HCP1200W
Revo Drive x2, 1.5TB WDB RAID0
16x DLRW
StrikeX S7
Full water cooling
3 x 27" Iiy

Sqawker

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Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2010, 04:50:16 pm »
Jannie,

Thanks for feedback on MoBo.  This reenforcement makes me confident in my choice. (Unfortunately, confidence is that feeling you have just before you know better. Just a joke. I do feel confident).

 In addition you would be a good source of knowledge.  Doing an actual build is a great education, and as they say - if you think an education is expensive, try ignorance.

Thanks, Sqawker

Re: Help for First Build
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2010, 05:01:24 pm »
CanUK, Mantis,

I looked at the HD 6850 (approx $260) and I would like to have it. Unfortunately I have to keep expenses down for the project and since I am not going to be gaming or anything unusual, the HD 5770 at $154 would fit my purpose very well.  Before I order, I will review and it will depend on which "ME" is at the keyboard - the impulsive me or the conservative me.

By the way, there are two HD 5770s both have same description except for one is "Express 2.0" and the other is "Express 2.1". My assumption is that I should get the 2.1 (I assume updated) version.  Is this a good assumption?

Thanks for the update.

Where are you at. In the US HD5770's go for around $150 and HD6850's go for around $200.

Bill
Main Box*i7 930@3.5 Ghz*CM V6 GT*GA X58A-UD3R v2 FB bios*3x4 gig Patriot DDR3 1600 EL*EVGA GTX 460 1 gig*OCZ Vertex 3 MI 120 gig*WD  Blue 500 gig*ASUS DRW-24B3LT*Samsung SH-S223L*Teac Floppy*Corsair AX750*Rosewill R6AR6-BK case*Windows 7 Ultimate 64 bit SP1