GA-H61N-USB3 - no POST, loop

[Urk]

Hi there,

On Saturday I purchased a GA-H61N-USB3 mini-itx board. Got it home and wired up and it will not boot.

The specs of the whole system are as follows, all parts bought new in store at Novatech on Saturday.
MOBO: GA-H61N-USB3
GPU: none, intergrated
CPU: i32120     
MEM: 2X2G DDR3 / 1333 (Novatech branded)
PSU: 220W, (cheapo, came with my Theraltake Element Q case)
DISK: 1 OCZ SSD, no optical drive.

The board powers up, all four cpu phase leds light up, ten seconds or so later the usb keyboard lights up for about another ten seconds then the board will either just power down, or the keyboard lights will go out and then after a few seconds the board powers down. This will then repeat on and on. The monitor does not get a signal at any point during the loop.

VERY occasionally it has POSTed and I have managed to get to the bios settings, (like about four times in two days!) I have not found any pattern to this it seems random (if very rare). I was able to confirm that all hardware (cpu/memory/ssd) was detected. Have tried various settings with no luck - the system just reenters the boot attempt loops.

I am working with the board on the workbench on the antistatic bag it came in, no shorts. I have reset the CMOS (jumper + extended, battery out method) and tried the backup bios using the wall switch method. I have tried running with one stick of RAM in each slot.

I have searched the forums and although surprisingly I could not find a single post relating to this particular MB, I did see many posts with other boot looping problems. I have tried all advice I could find and still no change.

My suspiciion was that the PSU was not up to the job as it was bundled with the case I bought. last night I used a nice 400W PSU from a system I am building for someone else and that did not work either - no change. (I then finished building said system, an i5 system and it is working perfectly.)
Also the RAM is rather cheap so I tried some ram from my main system and again, no change.
At this point I strongly suspect the motherboard is faulty, but I am surprised to find no way of troubleshooting this board, not even a speaker to beep codes at me! It seems it either works or not, and not indication as to where the fault may lie.

Is there anyone out there who can help?!

Rob

[absic]

Hi Rob,

looking at your system spec's the first thing I would note is that the PSU is very lightweight and although a minimum 200Watt PSU is recommended by Gigabyte for your motherboard this is where I would be looking as the initial cause of the problem.

PSU's that come with PC cases are not usually that good and I have had several instances where such units have failed and had to be replaced. If possible try a different PSU and see if you still have the problem.

[Urk]

Hi Absic,

Thanks for your reply.
I too had my doubts over the PSU, but as I point out towards the end of my post I have already tried a much bigger and better quality PSU from an i5 system I was building for someone else and there was no change. The i5 system is running happily away on this PSU so I know it is a good one.

Kind regards
Rob

[Dark Mantis]

I am working with the board on the workbench on the antistatic bag it came in, no shorts. I have reset the CMOS (jumper + extended, battery out method) and tried the backup bios using the wall switch method. I have tried running with one stick of RAM in each slot.

Hi

NEVER use an anti-static bag to run your motherboard on. The whole point of these bags is that they conduct electricity and so stop a build up of static from damaging the contents. If you are powering up a motherboad whilst it is laying on one it can act as a short on the back of the motherboard.

I would suggest the installation of a system buzzer too.

Have you got the ATX 12v plug inserted near the CPU too ?

[Urk]

That I did not realise, I thought it was just the inside of the bags that were treated.

Could this have damaged the board do you think?

The silly thing is that I was working just on the wooden worktop, but later placed the bag underneath it to keep things clean :-/

I have a buzzer to put in, but there is nowhere I could find on the board to put it? can you advise where I can install the buzzer on this mini-itx board?

Many thanks.

[Dark Mantis]

No, you are quite correct about the buzzer. This is opne of the few motherboards that Gigabyte makes without the possibility of attaching a buzzer/speaker to the motherboard. In my opinion really stupid but there we are.

Chances are you haven't damaged the board by using the anti-static bag. I have seen several people do it before and they all seemed to get away with it.

[Urk]

Thought not, I spent a while examining the board layout trying to find one!
Also I gather that the CPU phase LEDs are not really helpfull in this context either are they?

Is there anything else you can suggest for me to try?

All the power conenctors are indeed connected, believe it or not (what with the anti stat bag incident) I have sucsessfully put together many systems in the past.

Thanks again
Rob

[Dark Mantis]

I did think that you weren't exactly a newbie when it came to the building side of things. I can only suggest removing the CPU and checking all the pins in the socket for damage. I have included instructions but if you don't require them no problem.


Take all the usual anti-static precautions.

Very carefully remove the heatsink and fan. Probably a slight twisting motion is best to release the two as the thermal paste can act like a glue.

Once off remove the CPU taking extreme care both physically and electrically(static) and place somewhere safe.

Make sure that the lighting is very good and even.

Now scrutinise the socket for any pins that are out of alignment, even slightly.
If in any doubt whatsoever take a couple of macro (close up) photos of the socket and post them on here for us to check.

Also look at the bottom of the CPU at the lands (little copper circles) and make sure that there is a mark in each somewhere near the centre.
If there are any missing marks or any of the pins are obviously bent then that is your problem.

Before refitting the CPU clean off all residue of the old thermal paste and the same on the heatsink and then apply a small amount (about the size of a grain of rice) to the centre of the CPU once it is inserted in the socket.

[Urk]

Thanks for that DM.

Although I have reseated the CPU a couple of times now and didn't see anything out of place, I did find it difficult to see as the light wasn't great with my head blocking it!
When I get home I will try again and this time take some shots of the socket and the cpu pads and attatch them up here for scrutiny

Thanks
Rob

[Dark Mantis]

No problem. I know it's not always easy to get good photos of the socket pins but try without the flash if you can as the flash tends to blur things and give a lot of flare.

[Urk]

Made some actual progress, which is good as I was starting to lose hope!

I was going to just pull the CPU and look into that, but on a hunch I decided to try a graphics card first. Up until now I have only been using the on-board gfx (or trying to!).
So I nicked mf GFs PSU and dug up an old 8800 card and dropped it in and hey presto I can now POST and get to the bios on every single attempt.
I got to an actual BOOT just once, the first time I switched it on (it had been off and unplugged overnight). Apart from that once it never made to actually seek a boot device, it seems to die just at the point where you expect it to. I have no drives in the thing ATM anyway. (will boot off USB)

So this seems to point to a problem with the on-board graphics.
I have looked at the settings for this and set it to always on, and tried setting the on-board to the primary display, but if I take the card out (or try and switch to on-board with the gfx card still in, I get no monitor signal.

I thought that I should seek to update the bios, currently on F1 so I downloaded F3 (not up for trying the beta F4B just yet!).
But as I can’t get to a boot, and the quickflash app does not load (board dies at just the point you expect it to come up) I could not update.

I figured if I can stablise the system I can get it to boot / update the bios.

First things first, set the memory manually.
The AUTO settings did actually set the timings correctly (9,9,9,24), but I changed to manual (quick) settings and set them anyway.
Next the voltage. The memory is this stuff:
http://www.novatech.co.uk/products/components/memory-pc/ddr3-pc3-10666/1333mhz/ram-313334.html
(Yeah I know, cheap and cheerful!)
Says the voltage should be 1.8-1.9V (which seems a little high to me!) so I set the DRAM voltage from the auto setting of 1.5V to 1.8.
Still no change.

I guess the next thing I want to confirm are the other voltages around the system. I have read in other threads about problems on similar boards where the voltages were not being correctly set. This is stuff I certainly would need some guidance on though. I have not played around with any other voltages apart from the ones I have mentioned in this post.

My CPU core is set to 1.1000
My QPI/VTT voltage is currently 1.050V, I have seen others say that it should be 1.2V, is that right for this board?
I also noticed that the graphics core is set to 0.000V – could this be why I get no on-board graphics?!

Is there anything else I should be looking at?

Thanks

Rob

[Dark Mantis]

It doesn't help that I am not very familair with this motherboard but if the memroy calls for that voltage then it probably won't run with anything less. Try just one stick in the first slot and see if that helps.

Your QPI/Vtt seems to be dangerously low to me. I would expect it to be at least 1.3v if your RAM is set to 1.8v

As you mention yourself the RAM is cheap and cheerful but let's hope it also works. Until you can get it to boot though you can't run Memtest86+ to confirm that.

You were correct to manually set the memory timings and voltage though.

[Urk]

I don't think you are alone mate, in fact I think I am the first person to ever discuss this board on this forum!
(lucky old me)

Anyway, ah yes I remember now that qpi/vtt must be with .5v of the memory voltage (or else what?) so that will be the first thing I set when I get home, and I'll give it a go with just one stick.
I wonder if the system is protecting itself by not booting with such a wide mark between the two voltages? (is that wishfull thinking?)

Any comment on the other voltages at all?  CPU vCore at 1.100V, GFX Core at 0.000V!

Thanks for you continued interest in this.

[Dark Mantis]

The thing is the difference in voltage can cause the memory controller to burn out if it is more than 0.5v. Hopefully that hasn't happened but we shall soon know.

I am not sure whether the 0v it is displaying for the graphics is correct and there is a problem or it is merely showing that it is at default voltage and not been increased at all. 

Sorry.

[dikal]

I was going to just pull the CPU and look into that, but on a hunch I decided to try a graphics card first. Up until now I have only been using the on-board gfx (or trying to!).
So I nicked mf GFs PSU and dug up an old 8800 card and dropped it in and hey presto I can now POST and get to the bios on every single attempt.

Just check if this http://forum.giga-byte.co.uk/index.php/topic,7701.0.html is a similar situation, solved using a single-rail bigger PSU (as already absic suggested). In my opinion, the 400W PSU that you tried may not be strong enough.